Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:26 pmHi all
I am a student of comparative religion who has studied Islam for several years. I have come to the conclusion that the Koran is not the word of any deity and that it was largely plagiarized from various Christian myths, oral traditions, spurious writings and heresies which I shall endeavor to discuss In detail. I will apologize in advance for the length of this post but it cannot be helped.
The Gnostic Influence
I shall start by examining Gnosticism and it’s influence upon Islam. In the Koran we read
Surah 4.156-57:
"And for their saying, 'Verily we have slain the Messiah, Jesus the son of Mary, an Apostle of God.' Yet they slew him not, and they crucified him not, but they had only his likeness. And they who differed about him were in doubt concerning him: No sure knowledge had they about him, but followed only an opinion, and they did not really slay him, but God took him up to Himself. And God is Mighty, Wise!"
This is plagiarized from the Gnostic idea of the crucifixion. The Gnostics were an early Christian sect deemed heretical. The main Gnostic idea of doectism was that our physical existence was evil and only the spirit was good. They believed that Jesus was completely god in the spirit from but just appeared in human form just as an illusion. Hence they held that since Jesus held no physical form he could not be crucified. According to the Gnostics when the Romans went to crucify him he was transfigured and watched on laughing as they crucified Simon of Cyrene.
The Second Treatise of Great Seth (dating from the 2nd century)
“Yes, they saw me; they punished me. It was another, their father, who drank the gall and the vinegar; it was not I. They struck me with the reed; it was another, Simon, who bore the cross on his shoulder. I was another upon Whom they placed the crown of thorns. But I was rejoicing in the height over all the wealth of the archons and the offspring of their error, of their empty glory. And I was laughing at their ignorance
The Gnostic Apocolypse of peter (dating from the 2nd century.. not to be confused with the Apocalypse of Peter which is not agnostic text)
“when he said those things, I saw him seemingly being seized by them. And I said "What do I see, O Lord, that it is you yourself whom they take, and that you are grasping me? Or who is this one, glad and laughing on the tree? And is it another one whose feet and hands they are striking?"The Savior said to me, "He whom you saw on the tree, glad and laughing, this is the living Jesus. But thisone into whose hands and feet they drive the nails is his fleshly part, which is the substitute being put to shame, the one who came into being in his likeness. But look at him and me."
But I, when I had looked, said "Lord, no one is looking at you. Let us flee this place."
But he said to me, "I have told you, "Leave the blind alone!". And you, see how they do not know what theyare saying. For the son of their glory instead of my servant, they have put to shame."And I saw someone about to approach us resembling him, even him who was laughing on the tree.And he was filled with a Holy Spirit, and he is the Savior. And there was a great, ineffable light around them,and the multitude of ineffable and invisible angels blessing them. And when I looked at him, the one who gives praise was revealed.And he said to me, "Be strong, for you are the one to whom these mysteries have been given, to know themthrough revelation, that he whom they crucified is the first-born, and the home of demons, and the stony vessel,in which they dwell, of Elohim, of the cross, which is under the Law. But he who stands near him is the living Savior, the first in him, whom they seized and released, who stands joyfully looking those who did him violence,while they are divided among themselves. Therefore he laughs at their lack of perception, knowing that they are born blind. So then the one suspectible to suffering shall come, since the body is the substitute.But what they released was my incorporeal body. But I am the intellectual Spirit filled with radiant light.He whom you saw coming to me is our intellectual Pleroma , which unites the perfect light with my Holy Spirit."
The Acts of John (dating from the 2nd century)
”101 Nothing, therefore, of the things which they will say of me have I suffered: nay, that suffering also which I showed unto thee and the rest in the dance, I will that it be called a mystery. For what thou art, thou seest, for I showed it thee; but what I am I alone know, and no man else. Suffer me then to keep that which is mine, and that which is thine behold thou through me, and behold me in truth, that I am, not what I said, but what thou art able to know, because thou art akin thereto. Thou hearest that I suffered, yet did I not suffer; that I suffered not, yet did I suffer; that I was pierced, yet I was not smitten; hanged, and I was not hanged; that blood flowed from me, and it flowed not; and, in a word, what they say of me, that befell me not, but what they say not, that did I suffer. Now what those things are I signify unto thee, for I know that thou wilt understand. Perceive thou therefore in me the praising (al. slaying al. rest) of the (or a) Word (Logos), the piercing of the Word, the blood of the Word, the wound of the Word, the hanging up of the Word, the suffering of the Word, the nailing (fixing) of the Word, the death of the Word. And so speak I, separating off the manhood. Perceive thou therefore in the first place of the Word; then shalt thou perceive the Lord, and in the third place the man, and what he hath suffered.
102 When he had spoken unto me these things, and others which I know not how to say as he would have me, he was taken up, no one of the multitudes having beheld him. And when I went down I laughed them all to scorn, inasmuch as he had told me the things which they have said concerning him; holding fast this one thing in myself, that the Lord contrived all things symbolically and by a dispensation toward men, for their conversion and salvation. “
This concept of jesus not being crucified was first taught by the Gnostic teacher Basilides. Iraneus in his work, against the heresies further describes this Gnostic teaching which made its way into the Koran.
“in his stead; so that this latter being transfigured by him, that he might be thought to be Jesus, was crucified, through ignorance and error, while Jesus himself received the form of Simon, and, standing by, laughed at them. For since he was an incorporeal power, and the Nous (mind) of the unborn father, he transfigured himself as he pleased, and thus ascended to him who had sent him, deriding them, inasmuch as he could not be laid hold of, and was invisible to all….. If any one, therefore, he declares, confesses the crucified, that man is still a slave, and under the power of those who formed our bodies; but he who denies him has been freed from these beings, and is acquainted with the dispensation of the unborn father.”
So it is clear that Mohammad appropriated this idea of Jesus being replaced on the cross from Gnosticism.
The New testament Apocrypha:
The Koran Plagiarizes many tales about Jesus and Mary straight from the apocryphal gospels. The New Testament Apocrypha for those who don’t know is a collection of extracanonical Christian writings that did not make their way into the bible because they were heretical, spurious or were unimportant.
Surah Al-Maeda 5:110
"Thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave, and thou healest those born blind, and the lepers,"
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:49
"...I have come to you, with a Sign from your Lord, in that I make for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah's leave
This is plagiarised from the Infancy Gospel of Thomas vol. 1, p. 444 (written between 80-185 AD)
II. 1 This little child Jesus when he was five years old was playing at the ford of a brook: and he gathered together the waters that flowed there into pools, and made them straightway clean, and commanded them by his word alone. 2 And having made soft clay, he fashioned thereof twelve sparrows. And it was the Sabbath when he did these things (or made them). And there were also many other little children playing with him. 3 And a certain Jew when he saw what Jesus did, playing upon the Sabbath day, departed straightway and told his father Joseph: Lo, thy child is at the brook, and he hath taken clay and fashioned twelve little birds, and hath polluted the Sabbath day. 4 And Joseph came to the place and saw: and cried out to him, saying: Wherefore doest thou these things on the Sabbath, which it is not lawful to do? But Jesus clapped his hands together and cried out to the sparrows and said to them: Go! and the sparrows took their flight and went away chirping. 5 And when the Jews saw it they were amazed, and departed and told their chief men that which they had seen Jesus do.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:46
" He (Jesus) will speak unto mankind in his cradle and in his manhood, and he is of the righteous. "
In Surah Maryam 19:29-30
" But she (Mary) pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?. He (Jesus) said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet"
The Arabic Gospel of The Infancy of The Saviour. (This Gospel is believed by scholars to have originally been written in Aramaic by the Christian communities throughout the Levant, the gospel became very popular in Arabia which is how it acquired its name but it is not Arab in origin. Many scholars believe this gospel dates from the 5th and 6th centuries but due to its damaging nature Muslim scholars contend that its post Islamic)
1. We find (1) what follows in the book of Joseph the high priest, who lived in the time of Christ. Some say that he is Caiaphas. (2) He has said that Jesus spoke, and, indeed, when He was lying in His cradle said to Mary His mother: I am Jesus, the Son of God, the Logos, whom thou hast brought forth, as the Angel Gabriel announced to thee; and my Father has sent me for the salvation of the world.
Mohammad changed the original Jesus from saying that he is the Logos, the Son of god to a prophet of Allah. Mohammad took the tale but twisted it to suit his own ends
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:37
And her Lord accepted her with full acceptance and vouchsafed to her a goodly growth; and made Zachariah her guardian. Whenever Zachariah went into the sanctuary where she was, he found that she had foodHe said: O Mary! Whence cometh unto thee this (food)? She answered: It is from Allah. Allah giveth without stint to whom He will"
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James ( written between 140-170 AD)
VI. 1 And she made a sanctuary in her bed chamber and suffered nothing common or unclean to pass through it. And she called for the daughters of the Hebrews that were undefiled, and they carried her hither and thither.
VIII. 1 And her parents gat them down marveling, and praising the Lord God because tile child was not turned away backward.
And Mary was in the temple of the Lord as a dove that is nurtured: and she received food from the hand of an angel.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:44
This is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which We reveal unto thee (O Messenger!) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point).
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James (140-170 AD)
XIII 3 And the high priest took the vestment with the twelve bells and went in unto the Holy of Holies and prayed concerning her. And lo, an angel of tile Lord appeared saying unto him: Zacharias, Zacharias~ go forth and assemble them that are widowers of the people, and let them bring every man a rod, and to whomsoever the Lord shall show a sign, his wife shall she be. And the heralds went forth over all the country round about Judaea, and the trumpet of the Lord sounded, and all men ran thereto.
IX. 1 And Joseph cast down his adze and ran to meet them, and when they were gathered together they went to the high priest and took their rods with them. And he took the rods of them all and went into the temple and prayed. And when he had finished the prayer he took the rods and went forth and gave them back to them: and there was no sign upon them. But Joseph received the last rod: and 1o, a dove came forth of the rod and flew upon the bead of Joseph. And the priest said unto Joseph: Unto thee hath it fallen to take the virgin of the Lord and keep her for thyself.
The Gospel of The Nativity of Mary
CHAP. 8.--Now there was among the rest Joseph, of the house and family of David, a man of great age: and when all brought there rods, according to the order, he alone withheld his. Wherefore, when nothing in conformity with the divine voice appeared, the high priest thought it necessary to consult God a second time; and He answered, that of those who had been designated, he alone to whom the virgin ought to be espoused had not brought his rod. Joseph, therefore, was found out. For when he had brought his rod, and the dove came from heaven; and settled upon the top of it, it clearly appeared to all that he was the man to whom the virgin should be espoused. Therefore, the usual ceremonies of betrothal having been gone through, he went back to the city of Bethlehem to put his house in order, and to procure things necessary for the marriage. But Mary, the virgin of the Lord, with seven other virgins of her own age, and who had been weaned at the same time, whom she had received from the priest, returned to the house of her parents in Galilee.
The History of Joseph the Carpenter
3. Now when righteous Joseph became a widower, my mother Mary, blessed, holy, and pure, was already twelve years old. For her parents offered her in the temple when she was three years of age, and she remained in the temple of the Lord nine years. Then when the priests saw that the virgin, holy and God-fearing, was growing up, they spoke to each other, saying: Let us search out a man, righteous and pious, to whom Mary may be entrusted until the time of her marriage; lest, if she remain in the temple, it happen to her as is wont to happen to women, and lest on that account we sin, and God be angry with us.4. Therefore they immediately sent out, and assembled twelve old men of the tribe of Judah. And they wrote down the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. And the lot fell upon the pious old man, righteous Joseph. Then the priests answered, and said to my blessed mother: Go with Joseph, and be with him till the time of your marriage. Righteous Joseph therefore received my mother, and led her away to his own house
Surah Maryam 19:23-26
"023. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm-tree: She cried (in her anguish): "Ah! would that I had died before this! would that I had been a thing forgotten and out of sight!. 24. But (a voice) cried to her from beneath the (palm-tree): "Grieve not! for thy Lord hath provided a rivulet (stream) beneath thee; 25. And shake towards thyself the trunk of the palm-tree: It will let fall fresh ripe dates upon thee.26. So eat and drink and cool (thine) eye. And if thou dost see any man, say, 'I have vowed a fast to (Allah) Most Gracious, and this day will I enter into not talk with any human being'"
The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew (written between the 5th and 6th centuries)
CHAP. 20.-- And it came to pass on the third day of their journey, while they were walking, that the blessed Mary was fatigued by the excessive heat of the sun in the desert; and seeing a palm tree, she said to Joseph: Let me rest a little under the shade of this tree. Joseph therefore made haste, and led her to the palm, and made her come down from her beast. And as the blessed Mary was sitting there, she looked up to the foliage of the palm, and saw it full of fruit, and said to Joseph: I wish it were possible to get some of the fruit of this palm. And Joseph said to her: I wonder that thou sayest this, when thou seest how high the palm tree is; and that thou thinkest of eating of its fruit. I am thinking more of the want of water, because the skins are now empty, and we have none wherewith to refresh ourselves and our cattle. Then the child Jesus, with a joyful countenance, reposing in the bosom of His mother, said to the palm: O tree, bend thy branches, and refresh my mother with thy fruit. And immediately at these words the palm bent its top down to the very feet of the blessed Mary; and they gathered from it fruit, with which they were all refreshed. And after they had gathered all its fruit, it remained bent down, waiting the order to rise from Him who bad commanded it to stoop. Then Jesus said to it: Raise thyself, O palm tree, and be strong, and be the companion of my trees, which are in the paradise of my Father; and open from thy roots a vein of water which has been hid in the earth, and let the waters flow, so that we may be satisfied from thee. And it rose up immediately, and at its root there began to come forth a spring of water exceedingly clear and cool and sparkling. And when they saw the spring of water, they rejoiced with great joy, and were satisfied, themselves and all their cattle and their beasts. Wherefore they gave thanks to God.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:35-36
" 0.35. Behold! a woman of 'Imran said: "O my Lord! I do dedicate unto Thee what is in my womb for Thy special service: So accept this of me: For Thou hearest and knowest all things. 036. When she was delivered, she said: "O my Lord! Behold! I am delivered of a female child!"- and Allah knew best what she brought forth- "And no wise is the male Like the female. I have named her Mary"
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James (140-170 AD)
IV. 1 And behold an angel of the Lord appeared, saying unto her: Anna, Anna, the Lord hath hearkened unto thy prayer, and thou shalt conceive and bear, and thy seed shall be spoken of in the whole world. And Anna said: As the Lord my God liveth, if I bring forth either male or female, I will bring it for a gift unto the Lord my God, and it shall be ministering unto him all the days of its life.
2 And her months were fulfilled, and in the ninth month Anna brought forth. And she said unto the midwife: what have I brought forth ? And she said: A female. And Anna said: My soul is magnified this day, and she laid herself down. And when the days were fulfilled, Anna purified herself and gave suck to the child and called her name Mary.
Almost every story in the kroan about Jesus and Mary is plagiarized directly from these apocryphal gospels.
I am a student of comparative religion who has studied Islam for several years. I have come to the conclusion that the Koran is not the word of any deity and that it was largely plagiarized from various Christian myths, oral traditions, spurious writings and heresies which I shall endeavor to discuss In detail. I will apologize in advance for the length of this post but it cannot be helped.
The Gnostic Influence
I shall start by examining Gnosticism and it’s influence upon Islam. In the Koran we read
Surah 4.156-57:
"And for their saying, 'Verily we have slain the Messiah, Jesus the son of Mary, an Apostle of God.' Yet they slew him not, and they crucified him not, but they had only his likeness. And they who differed about him were in doubt concerning him: No sure knowledge had they about him, but followed only an opinion, and they did not really slay him, but God took him up to Himself. And God is Mighty, Wise!"
This is plagiarized from the Gnostic idea of the crucifixion. The Gnostics were an early Christian sect deemed heretical. The main Gnostic idea of doectism was that our physical existence was evil and only the spirit was good. They believed that Jesus was completely god in the spirit from but just appeared in human form just as an illusion. Hence they held that since Jesus held no physical form he could not be crucified. According to the Gnostics when the Romans went to crucify him he was transfigured and watched on laughing as they crucified Simon of Cyrene.
The Second Treatise of Great Seth (dating from the 2nd century)
“Yes, they saw me; they punished me. It was another, their father, who drank the gall and the vinegar; it was not I. They struck me with the reed; it was another, Simon, who bore the cross on his shoulder. I was another upon Whom they placed the crown of thorns. But I was rejoicing in the height over all the wealth of the archons and the offspring of their error, of their empty glory. And I was laughing at their ignorance
The Gnostic Apocolypse of peter (dating from the 2nd century.. not to be confused with the Apocalypse of Peter which is not agnostic text)
“when he said those things, I saw him seemingly being seized by them. And I said "What do I see, O Lord, that it is you yourself whom they take, and that you are grasping me? Or who is this one, glad and laughing on the tree? And is it another one whose feet and hands they are striking?"The Savior said to me, "He whom you saw on the tree, glad and laughing, this is the living Jesus. But thisone into whose hands and feet they drive the nails is his fleshly part, which is the substitute being put to shame, the one who came into being in his likeness. But look at him and me."
But I, when I had looked, said "Lord, no one is looking at you. Let us flee this place."
But he said to me, "I have told you, "Leave the blind alone!". And you, see how they do not know what theyare saying. For the son of their glory instead of my servant, they have put to shame."And I saw someone about to approach us resembling him, even him who was laughing on the tree.And he was filled with a Holy Spirit, and he is the Savior. And there was a great, ineffable light around them,and the multitude of ineffable and invisible angels blessing them. And when I looked at him, the one who gives praise was revealed.And he said to me, "Be strong, for you are the one to whom these mysteries have been given, to know themthrough revelation, that he whom they crucified is the first-born, and the home of demons, and the stony vessel,in which they dwell, of Elohim, of the cross, which is under the Law. But he who stands near him is the living Savior, the first in him, whom they seized and released, who stands joyfully looking those who did him violence,while they are divided among themselves. Therefore he laughs at their lack of perception, knowing that they are born blind. So then the one suspectible to suffering shall come, since the body is the substitute.But what they released was my incorporeal body. But I am the intellectual Spirit filled with radiant light.He whom you saw coming to me is our intellectual Pleroma , which unites the perfect light with my Holy Spirit."
The Acts of John (dating from the 2nd century)
”101 Nothing, therefore, of the things which they will say of me have I suffered: nay, that suffering also which I showed unto thee and the rest in the dance, I will that it be called a mystery. For what thou art, thou seest, for I showed it thee; but what I am I alone know, and no man else. Suffer me then to keep that which is mine, and that which is thine behold thou through me, and behold me in truth, that I am, not what I said, but what thou art able to know, because thou art akin thereto. Thou hearest that I suffered, yet did I not suffer; that I suffered not, yet did I suffer; that I was pierced, yet I was not smitten; hanged, and I was not hanged; that blood flowed from me, and it flowed not; and, in a word, what they say of me, that befell me not, but what they say not, that did I suffer. Now what those things are I signify unto thee, for I know that thou wilt understand. Perceive thou therefore in me the praising (al. slaying al. rest) of the (or a) Word (Logos), the piercing of the Word, the blood of the Word, the wound of the Word, the hanging up of the Word, the suffering of the Word, the nailing (fixing) of the Word, the death of the Word. And so speak I, separating off the manhood. Perceive thou therefore in the first place of the Word; then shalt thou perceive the Lord, and in the third place the man, and what he hath suffered.
102 When he had spoken unto me these things, and others which I know not how to say as he would have me, he was taken up, no one of the multitudes having beheld him. And when I went down I laughed them all to scorn, inasmuch as he had told me the things which they have said concerning him; holding fast this one thing in myself, that the Lord contrived all things symbolically and by a dispensation toward men, for their conversion and salvation. “
This concept of jesus not being crucified was first taught by the Gnostic teacher Basilides. Iraneus in his work, against the heresies further describes this Gnostic teaching which made its way into the Koran.
“in his stead; so that this latter being transfigured by him, that he might be thought to be Jesus, was crucified, through ignorance and error, while Jesus himself received the form of Simon, and, standing by, laughed at them. For since he was an incorporeal power, and the Nous (mind) of the unborn father, he transfigured himself as he pleased, and thus ascended to him who had sent him, deriding them, inasmuch as he could not be laid hold of, and was invisible to all….. If any one, therefore, he declares, confesses the crucified, that man is still a slave, and under the power of those who formed our bodies; but he who denies him has been freed from these beings, and is acquainted with the dispensation of the unborn father.”
So it is clear that Mohammad appropriated this idea of Jesus being replaced on the cross from Gnosticism.
The New testament Apocrypha:
The Koran Plagiarizes many tales about Jesus and Mary straight from the apocryphal gospels. The New Testament Apocrypha for those who don’t know is a collection of extracanonical Christian writings that did not make their way into the bible because they were heretical, spurious or were unimportant.
Surah Al-Maeda 5:110
"Thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave, and thou healest those born blind, and the lepers,"
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:49
"...I have come to you, with a Sign from your Lord, in that I make for you out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, and breathe into it, and it becomes a bird by Allah's leave
This is plagiarised from the Infancy Gospel of Thomas vol. 1, p. 444 (written between 80-185 AD)
II. 1 This little child Jesus when he was five years old was playing at the ford of a brook: and he gathered together the waters that flowed there into pools, and made them straightway clean, and commanded them by his word alone. 2 And having made soft clay, he fashioned thereof twelve sparrows. And it was the Sabbath when he did these things (or made them). And there were also many other little children playing with him. 3 And a certain Jew when he saw what Jesus did, playing upon the Sabbath day, departed straightway and told his father Joseph: Lo, thy child is at the brook, and he hath taken clay and fashioned twelve little birds, and hath polluted the Sabbath day. 4 And Joseph came to the place and saw: and cried out to him, saying: Wherefore doest thou these things on the Sabbath, which it is not lawful to do? But Jesus clapped his hands together and cried out to the sparrows and said to them: Go! and the sparrows took their flight and went away chirping. 5 And when the Jews saw it they were amazed, and departed and told their chief men that which they had seen Jesus do.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:46
" He (Jesus) will speak unto mankind in his cradle and in his manhood, and he is of the righteous. "
In Surah Maryam 19:29-30
" But she (Mary) pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?. He (Jesus) said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet"
The Arabic Gospel of The Infancy of The Saviour. (This Gospel is believed by scholars to have originally been written in Aramaic by the Christian communities throughout the Levant, the gospel became very popular in Arabia which is how it acquired its name but it is not Arab in origin. Many scholars believe this gospel dates from the 5th and 6th centuries but due to its damaging nature Muslim scholars contend that its post Islamic)
1. We find (1) what follows in the book of Joseph the high priest, who lived in the time of Christ. Some say that he is Caiaphas. (2) He has said that Jesus spoke, and, indeed, when He was lying in His cradle said to Mary His mother: I am Jesus, the Son of God, the Logos, whom thou hast brought forth, as the Angel Gabriel announced to thee; and my Father has sent me for the salvation of the world.
Mohammad changed the original Jesus from saying that he is the Logos, the Son of god to a prophet of Allah. Mohammad took the tale but twisted it to suit his own ends
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:37
And her Lord accepted her with full acceptance and vouchsafed to her a goodly growth; and made Zachariah her guardian. Whenever Zachariah went into the sanctuary where she was, he found that she had foodHe said: O Mary! Whence cometh unto thee this (food)? She answered: It is from Allah. Allah giveth without stint to whom He will"
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James ( written between 140-170 AD)
VI. 1 And she made a sanctuary in her bed chamber and suffered nothing common or unclean to pass through it. And she called for the daughters of the Hebrews that were undefiled, and they carried her hither and thither.
VIII. 1 And her parents gat them down marveling, and praising the Lord God because tile child was not turned away backward.
And Mary was in the temple of the Lord as a dove that is nurtured: and she received food from the hand of an angel.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:44
This is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which We reveal unto thee (O Messenger!) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point).
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James (140-170 AD)
XIII 3 And the high priest took the vestment with the twelve bells and went in unto the Holy of Holies and prayed concerning her. And lo, an angel of tile Lord appeared saying unto him: Zacharias, Zacharias~ go forth and assemble them that are widowers of the people, and let them bring every man a rod, and to whomsoever the Lord shall show a sign, his wife shall she be. And the heralds went forth over all the country round about Judaea, and the trumpet of the Lord sounded, and all men ran thereto.
IX. 1 And Joseph cast down his adze and ran to meet them, and when they were gathered together they went to the high priest and took their rods with them. And he took the rods of them all and went into the temple and prayed. And when he had finished the prayer he took the rods and went forth and gave them back to them: and there was no sign upon them. But Joseph received the last rod: and 1o, a dove came forth of the rod and flew upon the bead of Joseph. And the priest said unto Joseph: Unto thee hath it fallen to take the virgin of the Lord and keep her for thyself.
The Gospel of The Nativity of Mary
CHAP. 8.--Now there was among the rest Joseph, of the house and family of David, a man of great age: and when all brought there rods, according to the order, he alone withheld his. Wherefore, when nothing in conformity with the divine voice appeared, the high priest thought it necessary to consult God a second time; and He answered, that of those who had been designated, he alone to whom the virgin ought to be espoused had not brought his rod. Joseph, therefore, was found out. For when he had brought his rod, and the dove came from heaven; and settled upon the top of it, it clearly appeared to all that he was the man to whom the virgin should be espoused. Therefore, the usual ceremonies of betrothal having been gone through, he went back to the city of Bethlehem to put his house in order, and to procure things necessary for the marriage. But Mary, the virgin of the Lord, with seven other virgins of her own age, and who had been weaned at the same time, whom she had received from the priest, returned to the house of her parents in Galilee.
The History of Joseph the Carpenter
3. Now when righteous Joseph became a widower, my mother Mary, blessed, holy, and pure, was already twelve years old. For her parents offered her in the temple when she was three years of age, and she remained in the temple of the Lord nine years. Then when the priests saw that the virgin, holy and God-fearing, was growing up, they spoke to each other, saying: Let us search out a man, righteous and pious, to whom Mary may be entrusted until the time of her marriage; lest, if she remain in the temple, it happen to her as is wont to happen to women, and lest on that account we sin, and God be angry with us.4. Therefore they immediately sent out, and assembled twelve old men of the tribe of Judah. And they wrote down the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. And the lot fell upon the pious old man, righteous Joseph. Then the priests answered, and said to my blessed mother: Go with Joseph, and be with him till the time of your marriage. Righteous Joseph therefore received my mother, and led her away to his own house
Surah Maryam 19:23-26
"023. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm-tree: She cried (in her anguish): "Ah! would that I had died before this! would that I had been a thing forgotten and out of sight!. 24. But (a voice) cried to her from beneath the (palm-tree): "Grieve not! for thy Lord hath provided a rivulet (stream) beneath thee; 25. And shake towards thyself the trunk of the palm-tree: It will let fall fresh ripe dates upon thee.26. So eat and drink and cool (thine) eye. And if thou dost see any man, say, 'I have vowed a fast to (Allah) Most Gracious, and this day will I enter into not talk with any human being'"
The Gospel of Pseudo-Matthew (written between the 5th and 6th centuries)
CHAP. 20.-- And it came to pass on the third day of their journey, while they were walking, that the blessed Mary was fatigued by the excessive heat of the sun in the desert; and seeing a palm tree, she said to Joseph: Let me rest a little under the shade of this tree. Joseph therefore made haste, and led her to the palm, and made her come down from her beast. And as the blessed Mary was sitting there, she looked up to the foliage of the palm, and saw it full of fruit, and said to Joseph: I wish it were possible to get some of the fruit of this palm. And Joseph said to her: I wonder that thou sayest this, when thou seest how high the palm tree is; and that thou thinkest of eating of its fruit. I am thinking more of the want of water, because the skins are now empty, and we have none wherewith to refresh ourselves and our cattle. Then the child Jesus, with a joyful countenance, reposing in the bosom of His mother, said to the palm: O tree, bend thy branches, and refresh my mother with thy fruit. And immediately at these words the palm bent its top down to the very feet of the blessed Mary; and they gathered from it fruit, with which they were all refreshed. And after they had gathered all its fruit, it remained bent down, waiting the order to rise from Him who bad commanded it to stoop. Then Jesus said to it: Raise thyself, O palm tree, and be strong, and be the companion of my trees, which are in the paradise of my Father; and open from thy roots a vein of water which has been hid in the earth, and let the waters flow, so that we may be satisfied from thee. And it rose up immediately, and at its root there began to come forth a spring of water exceedingly clear and cool and sparkling. And when they saw the spring of water, they rejoiced with great joy, and were satisfied, themselves and all their cattle and their beasts. Wherefore they gave thanks to God.
Surah Al-E-Imran 3:35-36
" 0.35. Behold! a woman of 'Imran said: "O my Lord! I do dedicate unto Thee what is in my womb for Thy special service: So accept this of me: For Thou hearest and knowest all things. 036. When she was delivered, she said: "O my Lord! Behold! I am delivered of a female child!"- and Allah knew best what she brought forth- "And no wise is the male Like the female. I have named her Mary"
Protevangelium of James aka Gospel of James (140-170 AD)
IV. 1 And behold an angel of the Lord appeared, saying unto her: Anna, Anna, the Lord hath hearkened unto thy prayer, and thou shalt conceive and bear, and thy seed shall be spoken of in the whole world. And Anna said: As the Lord my God liveth, if I bring forth either male or female, I will bring it for a gift unto the Lord my God, and it shall be ministering unto him all the days of its life.
2 And her months were fulfilled, and in the ninth month Anna brought forth. And she said unto the midwife: what have I brought forth ? And she said: A female. And Anna said: My soul is magnified this day, and she laid herself down. And when the days were fulfilled, Anna purified herself and gave suck to the child and called her name Mary.
Almost every story in the kroan about Jesus and Mary is plagiarized directly from these apocryphal gospels.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:28 pmJannah:
In the Koran we read of Jannah (heaven)
Surah 2 al-Baqara
"25. But give glad tidings to those who believe and work righteousness that their portion is Gardens beneath which rivers flow. Every time they are fed with fruits therefrom they say: "Why this is what we were fed with before" for they are given things in similitude; and they have therein companions (pure and holy); and they abide therein (for ever)."
"133. Be quick in the race for forgiveness from your Lord and for a garden whose width is that (of the whole) of the heavens and of the earth prepared for the righteous"
Surah 3 Aali Imran
15. Say: shall I give you glad tidings of things far better than those? For the righteous are Gardens in nearness to their Lord with rivers flowing beneath; Therein is their eternal home; with spouses purified and the good pleasure of Allah, for in Allah's sight are (all) His servants
Surah 4 an-Nisaa
57. But those who believe and do deeds of righteousness We shall soon admit to gardens with rivers flowing beneath their eternal home: therein shall they have companions pure and holy: We shall admit them to shades cool and ever deepening.
Surah 9 at-Tawbah
72. Allah hath promised to believers men and women gardens under which rivers flow to dwell therein and beautiful mansions in gardens of everlasting bliss. But the greatest bliss in the Good Pleasure of Allah: that is the supreme felicity.
Surah 13 ar-Ra'd
23. Gardens of perpetual bliss: they shall enter there as well as the righteous among their fathers their spouses and their offspring: and angels shall enter unto them from every gate (with the salutation):
35. The parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised! beneath if flow rivers: perpetual is the enjoyment thereof and the shade therein: such is the End of the Righteous; and the End of Unbelievers is the Fire.
Surah 14 Ibrahim
23. But those who believe and work righteousness will be admitted to Gardens beneath which rivers flow to dwell therein for aye with the leave of their Lord: their greeting therein will be: "Peace
Surah: 15. al-Hijr
45. The righteous (will be) amid Gardens and fountains (of clear-flowing water).
Surah: 16. an-Nahl
31. Gardens of Eternity which they will enter: beneath them flow (pleasant) rivers: they will have therein all that they wish: thus doth Allah reward the righteous
Surah 44 ad-Dukhaan
51. As to the Righteous (they will be) in a position of Security
52. Among Gardens and Springs;
Surah: 47. Muhammed (salla Allhu alaihi wa sallam)
15. (Here is) a Parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised: in it are rivers of water incorruptible: rivers of milk of which the taste never changes; rivers of wine a joy to those who drink; and rivers of honey pure and clear. In it there are for them all kinds of fruits and Grace from their Lord. (Can those in such Bliss) be compared to such as shall dwell for ever in the Fire and be given to drink boiling water so that it cuts up their bowels (to pieces)?
Surah 55 ar-Rahman
46. But for such as fear the time when they will stand before (the Judgment Seat of) their Lord there will be two Gardens
47. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
48. Containing all kinds (of trees and delights)
49. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
50. In them (each) will be two Springs flowing (free);
51. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
52. In them will be Fruits of every kind two and two.
53. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
54. They will recline on Carpets whose inner linings will be of rich brocade: the Fruit of the Gardens will be ranged for the hand to pick
Surah 76 al-Insaan
5. As to the Righteous they shall drink of a Cup (of Wine) mixed with Kafur 6. A Fountain where the Devotees of Allah do drink making it flow in unstinted abundance
14. And the shades of the (Garden) will come low over them and the bunches (of fruit) there will hang low in humility
17. And they will be given to drink there of a Cup (of Wine) mixed with Zanjabil
18. A fountain there called Salsabil. 19. And round about them will (serve) youths of perpetual (freshness): if thou seest them thou wouldst think them scattered Pearls
Surah 77 al-Mursalaat
41. As to the righteous, they shall be amidst (cool) shades and springs (of water)
42. And (they shall have) fruits, -all they desire.
Surah 78 an-Naba'
31. Verily for the righteous there will be a fulfillment of (the Heart's) desires;
32. Gardens enclosed and Grape-vines;
Surah: 83. at-Tatfeef
25. Their thirst will be slaked with Pure Wine sealed
The Koran’s Heaven is plagiarized from a cycle of Christian hymns called “Hymns on Paradise” which were written by the 4th Century Christian Saint, St Ephrem the Syrian. St Ephrem writing 300 years before Mohammad describes heaven as a garden full of trees under which the faithful recline and pick fruit ranged for the hand to pick. The inhabitants of heaven drink wine and like the Koran it says that those who don’t drink wine on earth will drink it in heaven. It talks about the exalted status of Martyrs and describes fountains and springs. Also rivers of wine, milk and honey.
Hymn II
"8. Who is capable of gazing upon the Gardens splendor, seeing how glorious it is in all its design, how harmonious in its proportions, how spacious for those who dwell there, how radiant with its abodes? Its fountains delight with their fragrance"
Hymn VI
"11. The diligent carry their own fruits and now run forward to meet Paradise as it exults with every sort of fruit. They enter that Garden with glorious deeds and it sees that the fruits of the just surpass in their excellence the fruits of its own trees, and that the adornment of the victorious outrival its own. 12. Happy indeed is the person accounted worthy to behold in Paradise the glorious fruits of the trees."
Hymn VII
"3. Bear up, O life of mourning, so that you may attain to Paradise; its dew will wash off your squalor, while what it exudes will render you fragrant; its support will afford rest after your toil, its crown will give you comfort, it will proffer you fruits in your hunger, fruits that purify those who partake of them; in your thirst it will provide for you a celestial draught, one that makes wise those who drink it.
"18. The man who abstained, with understanding, from wine, will the vines of paradise rush out to meet, all the more joyfully as each one stretches out and proffers him its clusters; or if any has lived a life of virginity, him too they welcome into their bosom, for the solitary such as has never lain in any bosom nor upon any bosom nor upon any marriage bed. 19. Those who have been crowned for our Lord's sake with the martyr's death by the sword shine out in glory there with their crowns
because their bodies despised the persecutors fire. Like stars they do blossom in Paradise."
"26. And if none who is defiled enter that place allow me to live by its enclosure residing in the shade."
Hymn IV
"3. Should you wish to climb up a tree, with its lower branches it will provide steps before your feet, eager to make you recline in its bosom above, on the couch of its upper branches. So arranged is the surface of these branches, bent low and cupped, while yet dense with flowers that they serve as a protective womb for whoever rests there 4. Who has ever beheld such a banquet in the very bosom of a tree, with fruit of every savor ranged for the hand to pluck.
Each type of fruit in due sequence approaches, each awaiting its turn: fruit to eat, and fruit to quench the thirst; to rinse the hands there is dew, and leaves to dry them with after- a treasure store which lacks nothing, whose Lord is rich in all things 5. Around the tree the air is limpid as the saints recline; below them are blossoms, above them are fruit; fruits serve as their sky, flowers as their earth. Who has ever heard of or seen a cloud of fruits providing shade for the head, or a garment of flowers spread out beneath the feet? 6. Such is the flowing brook of delights that, as one tree takes leave of you, the next one beckons to you; all of them rejoice that you should partake of the fruit of one and suck the juice of another, wash and cleanse yourself in the dew of yet a third; anoint yourself with the resin of one and breath another's fragrance, listen to the song of still another. Blessed is he who gave joy to Adam!
Hymn X
"6. There the abundant flow of their produce is ceaseless for each bears its own fruit, its neighbor, flowers. There the spring of delights open up and flow with wine, milk, honey and cream.
10. Each month's fruits and flowers posses individually their own particular treasures, but when these are cross fertilized, they multiply; when two neighboring flowers, each with its distinctive colour are crossed to become one, they produce a new colour. When fruits are thus crossed they create a new and beautiful offspring whose foliage is different 11. In Paradise the life cycle of trees resembles a necklance: when the fruits of the first are finished and plucked, then the second ones are ready, with a third species following them. Who has ever beheld autumnal fruits grasping the heels of the first fruits, just as jacob grasped hold of his brother's heal?
Hymn XI
" 1. The air of Paradise is a fountain of delight from which Adam sucked when he was young; its very breath, like a mother's breast, gave him nourishment in his childhood... 2. No harmful frost, no scorching heat is to be found in that blessed place of delight; it is a harbor of joys, a haven of pleasures; light and rejoicing have their home there; gathered there are to be found harps and lyres with shouts of Hosanna and the Church crying "Alleluia".
11 What need was there from that land a river should flow forth and divide itself except that the blessings of Paradise should be mingled by the means of water as it issues forth to irrigate the world, making clean its fountains12. Thus but us with another spring, full of perfumes which issue from Eden and penetrates into the atmosphere as a beneficial breeze by which our souls are stirred; our inhalation is healed by this healing breath from Paradise;
Hymn XV
"All this and similar things that I have read in the scriptures, have helped depict in my mind that Garden of Life; blessed is the person who is worthy to attain its enjoyment. May the Merciful One bring me to its fruits,may their taste give me life, or their scent strike me, or the radiance reach me or the dew bathe me!"
It is clear that the Koran’s heaven was directly plagiaries From the “Hymns On Paradise”. Some scholars have even suggested that the verse about those who remained virgins being welcomed into the (bosoms of women) is believed to be the origin of the Islamic houries/virgins in paradise. This is all that the Islamic heaven is, one 4th century Saint’s depiction of heaven and thus it become unbelievable since this saint never once claimed to have this divinely revealed to him. his hymns were nothing more than poetry and not deemed authoritative in any way by him. Why should we believe ina god who has to plagiarize his heaven from some hymns? But then again maybe St Ephrem was really a Muslim lol.
The Companions of the cave:
In the Koran there is a tale called "the companions of the cave" about some youths who hide in a cave and sleep for hundreds of years
Surah Al-Kahf
09. Or dost thou reflect that the Companions of the Cave and of the Inscription were wonders among Our Sign? 10. When the youths took refuge in the Cave saying, 'Our lord, give us mercy from Thee, and furnish us with rectitude in our affair. 11. Then We draw (a veil) over their ears, for a number of years, in the Cave, (so that they heard not); 12. Then We roused them, in order to test which of the two parties was best at calculating the term of years they had tarried! 13. We will relate to thee their tidings truly. They were youths who believed in their Lord, and We increased them in guidance. 14. And We strengthened their hearts, when they stood up and said, 'Our Lord is the Lord of the heavens and earth; we will not call upon any god, apart from Him, or then we had spoken outrage.15. These our people have taken to them other gods, apart from Him. Ah, if only they would bring some clear authority regarding them! But who does greater evil than he who forges against 16. "When ye turn away from them and the things they worship other than Allah, betake yourselves to the Cave: Your Lord will shower His mercies on you and disposes of your affair towards comfort and ease." 17. Thou wouldst have seen the sun, when it rose, declining to the right from their Cave, and when it set, turning away from them to the left, while they lay in the open space in the midst of the Cave. Such are among the Signs of Allah. He whom Allah, guides is rightly guided; but he whom Allah leaves to stray,- for him wilt thou find no protector to lead him to the Right Way.18.Thou wouldst have thought them awake, as they lay sleeping, while We turned them 'now to the right, now to the left,' and their dog 'stretching its paws on the threshold'. Hadst thou observed them surely thou wouldst have turned thy back on them in flight, and been filled with terror of them. 19. Such being their state, we raised them up (from sleep), that they might question each other. Said one of them, "How long have ye stayed (here)?" They said, "We have stayed perhaps a day, or part of a day." At length they all said, "Allah alone knows best how long ye have stayed here.... Now send ye then one of you with this money of yours to the town: let him find out which is the best food to be had and bring some to youthat ye may satisfy your hunger therewith: And let him behave with care and courtesy, and let him not inform any one about you. 20. "For if they should come upon you, they would stone you or force you to return to their cult, and in that case ye would never attain prosperity." 21. And even so We made them stumble upon some people, that they might know that God's promise is true, and that the Hour (day of judgment) -- there is no doubt of it. When they were contending among themselves of their affair then they said, 'Build over them a building; their Lord knows of them very well.' Said those who prevailed over their affair, 'We will raise over them a place of worship.' 22. Some say they were three, the dog being the fourth among them; others say they were five, the dog being the sixth,- doubtfully guessing at the unknown; yet others say they were seven, the dog being the eighth. Say thou: "My Lord knoweth best their number; It is but few that know their real case." Enter not, therefore, into controversies concerning them, except on a matter that is clear, nor consult any of them about the affair of the Sleepers. 23. Nor say of anything, "I shall be sure to do so and so tomorrow"- 24. Without adding, "So please Allah." and call thy Lord to mind when thou forgettest, and say, "I hope that my Lord will guide me ever closer even than this to the right road." 25. So they stayed in their Cave three hundred years, and some add nine more. 26. Say: "Allah knows best how long they stayed.
This entire tale was plagiarized from a Christian myth called the 7 sleepers of Ephesus first Recorded by Jacob of Suarag in the 5th century in Syriac and then translated into Latin by in the 6th century Gregory of Tours in his work "The Glory of the Martyrs" of which the following is an extract
Here is an account of seven brothers who are buried at Ephesus. During the reign of the Emperor Decius (249- 251 AD) , when there was a persecution against the Christians, seven men were captured and brought before the Emperor. These seven men were named Maximianus, Malchus, Martinianus, Constantinus, Dionysius, Johannes and Serapion. Although they were tempted by various suggestions to yield, they never acquiesced. Because of his regard for them, the Emperor granted them time to think, so that they would not die immediately. But the seven men shut themselves up in one cave, and they lived for many days. One of them would leave, purchase supplies, and bring back necessities. When the Emperor returned to Ephesus , the seven men requested of the Lord that he design to rescue them from this danger. They prayed, and while bowed to the ground they fell asleep. When the Emperor learned that they were staying in this cave, by the will of god he ordered that the mouth of the cave be blocked off with huge stones. He said "Let those who refuse to sacrifice to our gods die there" While this was being done, a Christian wrote the names of the martyrs on a lead tablet and secretly put it in the entrance of to the cave before it was blocked off. After many years had gone by and peace had been granted to the Churches, Theodosius II (408-450), a Christian became Emperor. The impure heresy of the Sadducees, who denied that there would be a resurrection, was spreading. Then a citizen of Ephesus who decided to use this mountain as a sheepfold for his flocks overturned stones for the construction of walls for his pens. Not knowing what happened within, he opened the entrance to the cave; but did not find the inner chamber that was further inside. The Lord sent the breath of life to the seven men and they awoke. Thinking that they had been asleep for only one night, they sent a young man from their number to purchase food. When the young man came to the gate of the city, he was surprised upon seeing an image of the glorious cross and hearing the people take oaths in the name of Christ. As soon as he presented the coins he had from the reign of Decius, a merchant seized him and said: "You have found a hoard that was buried years ago." The young man denied the accusation and was brought to the bishop and judge of the city who denounced him. Compelled by force the young man revealed a hidden mystery and brought them to the cave where the other men were. As the bishop entered he found a lead tablet on which everything had been recoded in writing. the bishop spoke with the men; then the bishop and the judge quickly announced the news to the Emperor Theodosius. The emperor came and they honored him by kneeling on the ground. The seven men spoke to the Emperor with these words: " A heresy has spread, glorious Augustus, that attempts to mislead Christian people from the promises of God by saying that there is no resurrection of the dead. Therefore because as you know we will all beheld responsible before the tribunal of Christ in accordance with what the apostle Paul wrote (II Corintians 5:10), the lord has ordered us to awake and say these things to you. Take care lest you be seduced and excluded from the kingdom." The Emperor Theodosius listened and glorified the lord who did not allow his people to perish. But the men again lay down and fell asleep ..Even today the men lie asleep in that spot, covered by cloaks made of silk or linen. The record of their suffering which with the assistance of a Syrian I translated into Latin gives a fuller account.
It is clear that Mohammad plagiarized The Companions of the cave from the earlier Christian tale, the 7 sleepers of Ephesus which is exactly the same but Mohammad changed it from being about Christians persecuted by the Romans for not following their gods to being about Muslims persecuted for not following pagan gods. From the Islamic perspective this tale makes no sense as the men came back to warn Theodosius II a Christian emperor of a heretical danger to Christianity which denied the day of resurrection but this is the very same religion that Mohammad would later denounce. So why Allah would want to protect it? this makes no sense so this is obviously why Mohammad removed it from its Christian context. The Incredibility of this tale is furthered by having the sleepers from the original tale quoting St Paul, who Muslims consider a false prophet. There is no way that the original tale fits with Islamic theology in any sense and as I have proven Mohammad twisted it to suit his own ends. But im sure muslims will say this version is corrupted and only the Koran has it right. If so bring some proof!
It is clear that Mohammad plagiarized many beliefs, teachings, doctrines and stories from Christianity. I have proven so conclusively and Muslims cant deny this irrefutable evidence. The Koran is not the word of any deity but of a 7th century Arabian plagiarist
In the Koran we read of Jannah (heaven)
Surah 2 al-Baqara
"25. But give glad tidings to those who believe and work righteousness that their portion is Gardens beneath which rivers flow. Every time they are fed with fruits therefrom they say: "Why this is what we were fed with before" for they are given things in similitude; and they have therein companions (pure and holy); and they abide therein (for ever)."
"133. Be quick in the race for forgiveness from your Lord and for a garden whose width is that (of the whole) of the heavens and of the earth prepared for the righteous"
Surah 3 Aali Imran
15. Say: shall I give you glad tidings of things far better than those? For the righteous are Gardens in nearness to their Lord with rivers flowing beneath; Therein is their eternal home; with spouses purified and the good pleasure of Allah, for in Allah's sight are (all) His servants
Surah 4 an-Nisaa
57. But those who believe and do deeds of righteousness We shall soon admit to gardens with rivers flowing beneath their eternal home: therein shall they have companions pure and holy: We shall admit them to shades cool and ever deepening.
Surah 9 at-Tawbah
72. Allah hath promised to believers men and women gardens under which rivers flow to dwell therein and beautiful mansions in gardens of everlasting bliss. But the greatest bliss in the Good Pleasure of Allah: that is the supreme felicity.
Surah 13 ar-Ra'd
23. Gardens of perpetual bliss: they shall enter there as well as the righteous among their fathers their spouses and their offspring: and angels shall enter unto them from every gate (with the salutation):
35. The parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised! beneath if flow rivers: perpetual is the enjoyment thereof and the shade therein: such is the End of the Righteous; and the End of Unbelievers is the Fire.
Surah 14 Ibrahim
23. But those who believe and work righteousness will be admitted to Gardens beneath which rivers flow to dwell therein for aye with the leave of their Lord: their greeting therein will be: "Peace
Surah: 15. al-Hijr
45. The righteous (will be) amid Gardens and fountains (of clear-flowing water).
Surah: 16. an-Nahl
31. Gardens of Eternity which they will enter: beneath them flow (pleasant) rivers: they will have therein all that they wish: thus doth Allah reward the righteous
Surah 44 ad-Dukhaan
51. As to the Righteous (they will be) in a position of Security
52. Among Gardens and Springs;
Surah: 47. Muhammed (salla Allhu alaihi wa sallam)
15. (Here is) a Parable of the Garden which the righteous are promised: in it are rivers of water incorruptible: rivers of milk of which the taste never changes; rivers of wine a joy to those who drink; and rivers of honey pure and clear. In it there are for them all kinds of fruits and Grace from their Lord. (Can those in such Bliss) be compared to such as shall dwell for ever in the Fire and be given to drink boiling water so that it cuts up their bowels (to pieces)?
Surah 55 ar-Rahman
46. But for such as fear the time when they will stand before (the Judgment Seat of) their Lord there will be two Gardens
47. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
48. Containing all kinds (of trees and delights)
49. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
50. In them (each) will be two Springs flowing (free);
51. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
52. In them will be Fruits of every kind two and two.
53. Then which of the favors of your Lord will ye deny?
54. They will recline on Carpets whose inner linings will be of rich brocade: the Fruit of the Gardens will be ranged for the hand to pick
Surah 76 al-Insaan
5. As to the Righteous they shall drink of a Cup (of Wine) mixed with Kafur 6. A Fountain where the Devotees of Allah do drink making it flow in unstinted abundance
14. And the shades of the (Garden) will come low over them and the bunches (of fruit) there will hang low in humility
17. And they will be given to drink there of a Cup (of Wine) mixed with Zanjabil
18. A fountain there called Salsabil. 19. And round about them will (serve) youths of perpetual (freshness): if thou seest them thou wouldst think them scattered Pearls
Surah 77 al-Mursalaat
41. As to the righteous, they shall be amidst (cool) shades and springs (of water)
42. And (they shall have) fruits, -all they desire.
Surah 78 an-Naba'
31. Verily for the righteous there will be a fulfillment of (the Heart's) desires;
32. Gardens enclosed and Grape-vines;
Surah: 83. at-Tatfeef
25. Their thirst will be slaked with Pure Wine sealed
The Koran’s Heaven is plagiarized from a cycle of Christian hymns called “Hymns on Paradise” which were written by the 4th Century Christian Saint, St Ephrem the Syrian. St Ephrem writing 300 years before Mohammad describes heaven as a garden full of trees under which the faithful recline and pick fruit ranged for the hand to pick. The inhabitants of heaven drink wine and like the Koran it says that those who don’t drink wine on earth will drink it in heaven. It talks about the exalted status of Martyrs and describes fountains and springs. Also rivers of wine, milk and honey.
Hymn II
"8. Who is capable of gazing upon the Gardens splendor, seeing how glorious it is in all its design, how harmonious in its proportions, how spacious for those who dwell there, how radiant with its abodes? Its fountains delight with their fragrance"
Hymn VI
"11. The diligent carry their own fruits and now run forward to meet Paradise as it exults with every sort of fruit. They enter that Garden with glorious deeds and it sees that the fruits of the just surpass in their excellence the fruits of its own trees, and that the adornment of the victorious outrival its own. 12. Happy indeed is the person accounted worthy to behold in Paradise the glorious fruits of the trees."
Hymn VII
"3. Bear up, O life of mourning, so that you may attain to Paradise; its dew will wash off your squalor, while what it exudes will render you fragrant; its support will afford rest after your toil, its crown will give you comfort, it will proffer you fruits in your hunger, fruits that purify those who partake of them; in your thirst it will provide for you a celestial draught, one that makes wise those who drink it.
"18. The man who abstained, with understanding, from wine, will the vines of paradise rush out to meet, all the more joyfully as each one stretches out and proffers him its clusters; or if any has lived a life of virginity, him too they welcome into their bosom, for the solitary such as has never lain in any bosom nor upon any bosom nor upon any marriage bed. 19. Those who have been crowned for our Lord's sake with the martyr's death by the sword shine out in glory there with their crowns
because their bodies despised the persecutors fire. Like stars they do blossom in Paradise."
"26. And if none who is defiled enter that place allow me to live by its enclosure residing in the shade."
Hymn IV
"3. Should you wish to climb up a tree, with its lower branches it will provide steps before your feet, eager to make you recline in its bosom above, on the couch of its upper branches. So arranged is the surface of these branches, bent low and cupped, while yet dense with flowers that they serve as a protective womb for whoever rests there 4. Who has ever beheld such a banquet in the very bosom of a tree, with fruit of every savor ranged for the hand to pluck.
Each type of fruit in due sequence approaches, each awaiting its turn: fruit to eat, and fruit to quench the thirst; to rinse the hands there is dew, and leaves to dry them with after- a treasure store which lacks nothing, whose Lord is rich in all things 5. Around the tree the air is limpid as the saints recline; below them are blossoms, above them are fruit; fruits serve as their sky, flowers as their earth. Who has ever heard of or seen a cloud of fruits providing shade for the head, or a garment of flowers spread out beneath the feet? 6. Such is the flowing brook of delights that, as one tree takes leave of you, the next one beckons to you; all of them rejoice that you should partake of the fruit of one and suck the juice of another, wash and cleanse yourself in the dew of yet a third; anoint yourself with the resin of one and breath another's fragrance, listen to the song of still another. Blessed is he who gave joy to Adam!
Hymn X
"6. There the abundant flow of their produce is ceaseless for each bears its own fruit, its neighbor, flowers. There the spring of delights open up and flow with wine, milk, honey and cream.
10. Each month's fruits and flowers posses individually their own particular treasures, but when these are cross fertilized, they multiply; when two neighboring flowers, each with its distinctive colour are crossed to become one, they produce a new colour. When fruits are thus crossed they create a new and beautiful offspring whose foliage is different 11. In Paradise the life cycle of trees resembles a necklance: when the fruits of the first are finished and plucked, then the second ones are ready, with a third species following them. Who has ever beheld autumnal fruits grasping the heels of the first fruits, just as jacob grasped hold of his brother's heal?
Hymn XI
" 1. The air of Paradise is a fountain of delight from which Adam sucked when he was young; its very breath, like a mother's breast, gave him nourishment in his childhood... 2. No harmful frost, no scorching heat is to be found in that blessed place of delight; it is a harbor of joys, a haven of pleasures; light and rejoicing have their home there; gathered there are to be found harps and lyres with shouts of Hosanna and the Church crying "Alleluia".
11 What need was there from that land a river should flow forth and divide itself except that the blessings of Paradise should be mingled by the means of water as it issues forth to irrigate the world, making clean its fountains12. Thus but us with another spring, full of perfumes which issue from Eden and penetrates into the atmosphere as a beneficial breeze by which our souls are stirred; our inhalation is healed by this healing breath from Paradise;
Hymn XV
"All this and similar things that I have read in the scriptures, have helped depict in my mind that Garden of Life; blessed is the person who is worthy to attain its enjoyment. May the Merciful One bring me to its fruits,may their taste give me life, or their scent strike me, or the radiance reach me or the dew bathe me!"
It is clear that the Koran’s heaven was directly plagiaries From the “Hymns On Paradise”. Some scholars have even suggested that the verse about those who remained virgins being welcomed into the (bosoms of women) is believed to be the origin of the Islamic houries/virgins in paradise. This is all that the Islamic heaven is, one 4th century Saint’s depiction of heaven and thus it become unbelievable since this saint never once claimed to have this divinely revealed to him. his hymns were nothing more than poetry and not deemed authoritative in any way by him. Why should we believe ina god who has to plagiarize his heaven from some hymns? But then again maybe St Ephrem was really a Muslim lol.
The Companions of the cave:
In the Koran there is a tale called "the companions of the cave" about some youths who hide in a cave and sleep for hundreds of years
Surah Al-Kahf
09. Or dost thou reflect that the Companions of the Cave and of the Inscription were wonders among Our Sign? 10. When the youths took refuge in the Cave saying, 'Our lord, give us mercy from Thee, and furnish us with rectitude in our affair. 11. Then We draw (a veil) over their ears, for a number of years, in the Cave, (so that they heard not); 12. Then We roused them, in order to test which of the two parties was best at calculating the term of years they had tarried! 13. We will relate to thee their tidings truly. They were youths who believed in their Lord, and We increased them in guidance. 14. And We strengthened their hearts, when they stood up and said, 'Our Lord is the Lord of the heavens and earth; we will not call upon any god, apart from Him, or then we had spoken outrage.15. These our people have taken to them other gods, apart from Him. Ah, if only they would bring some clear authority regarding them! But who does greater evil than he who forges against 16. "When ye turn away from them and the things they worship other than Allah, betake yourselves to the Cave: Your Lord will shower His mercies on you and disposes of your affair towards comfort and ease." 17. Thou wouldst have seen the sun, when it rose, declining to the right from their Cave, and when it set, turning away from them to the left, while they lay in the open space in the midst of the Cave. Such are among the Signs of Allah. He whom Allah, guides is rightly guided; but he whom Allah leaves to stray,- for him wilt thou find no protector to lead him to the Right Way.18.Thou wouldst have thought them awake, as they lay sleeping, while We turned them 'now to the right, now to the left,' and their dog 'stretching its paws on the threshold'. Hadst thou observed them surely thou wouldst have turned thy back on them in flight, and been filled with terror of them. 19. Such being their state, we raised them up (from sleep), that they might question each other. Said one of them, "How long have ye stayed (here)?" They said, "We have stayed perhaps a day, or part of a day." At length they all said, "Allah alone knows best how long ye have stayed here.... Now send ye then one of you with this money of yours to the town: let him find out which is the best food to be had and bring some to youthat ye may satisfy your hunger therewith: And let him behave with care and courtesy, and let him not inform any one about you. 20. "For if they should come upon you, they would stone you or force you to return to their cult, and in that case ye would never attain prosperity." 21. And even so We made them stumble upon some people, that they might know that God's promise is true, and that the Hour (day of judgment) -- there is no doubt of it. When they were contending among themselves of their affair then they said, 'Build over them a building; their Lord knows of them very well.' Said those who prevailed over their affair, 'We will raise over them a place of worship.' 22. Some say they were three, the dog being the fourth among them; others say they were five, the dog being the sixth,- doubtfully guessing at the unknown; yet others say they were seven, the dog being the eighth. Say thou: "My Lord knoweth best their number; It is but few that know their real case." Enter not, therefore, into controversies concerning them, except on a matter that is clear, nor consult any of them about the affair of the Sleepers. 23. Nor say of anything, "I shall be sure to do so and so tomorrow"- 24. Without adding, "So please Allah." and call thy Lord to mind when thou forgettest, and say, "I hope that my Lord will guide me ever closer even than this to the right road." 25. So they stayed in their Cave three hundred years, and some add nine more. 26. Say: "Allah knows best how long they stayed.
This entire tale was plagiarized from a Christian myth called the 7 sleepers of Ephesus first Recorded by Jacob of Suarag in the 5th century in Syriac and then translated into Latin by in the 6th century Gregory of Tours in his work "The Glory of the Martyrs" of which the following is an extract
Here is an account of seven brothers who are buried at Ephesus. During the reign of the Emperor Decius (249- 251 AD) , when there was a persecution against the Christians, seven men were captured and brought before the Emperor. These seven men were named Maximianus, Malchus, Martinianus, Constantinus, Dionysius, Johannes and Serapion. Although they were tempted by various suggestions to yield, they never acquiesced. Because of his regard for them, the Emperor granted them time to think, so that they would not die immediately. But the seven men shut themselves up in one cave, and they lived for many days. One of them would leave, purchase supplies, and bring back necessities. When the Emperor returned to Ephesus , the seven men requested of the Lord that he design to rescue them from this danger. They prayed, and while bowed to the ground they fell asleep. When the Emperor learned that they were staying in this cave, by the will of god he ordered that the mouth of the cave be blocked off with huge stones. He said "Let those who refuse to sacrifice to our gods die there" While this was being done, a Christian wrote the names of the martyrs on a lead tablet and secretly put it in the entrance of to the cave before it was blocked off. After many years had gone by and peace had been granted to the Churches, Theodosius II (408-450), a Christian became Emperor. The impure heresy of the Sadducees, who denied that there would be a resurrection, was spreading. Then a citizen of Ephesus who decided to use this mountain as a sheepfold for his flocks overturned stones for the construction of walls for his pens. Not knowing what happened within, he opened the entrance to the cave; but did not find the inner chamber that was further inside. The Lord sent the breath of life to the seven men and they awoke. Thinking that they had been asleep for only one night, they sent a young man from their number to purchase food. When the young man came to the gate of the city, he was surprised upon seeing an image of the glorious cross and hearing the people take oaths in the name of Christ. As soon as he presented the coins he had from the reign of Decius, a merchant seized him and said: "You have found a hoard that was buried years ago." The young man denied the accusation and was brought to the bishop and judge of the city who denounced him. Compelled by force the young man revealed a hidden mystery and brought them to the cave where the other men were. As the bishop entered he found a lead tablet on which everything had been recoded in writing. the bishop spoke with the men; then the bishop and the judge quickly announced the news to the Emperor Theodosius. The emperor came and they honored him by kneeling on the ground. The seven men spoke to the Emperor with these words: " A heresy has spread, glorious Augustus, that attempts to mislead Christian people from the promises of God by saying that there is no resurrection of the dead. Therefore because as you know we will all beheld responsible before the tribunal of Christ in accordance with what the apostle Paul wrote (II Corintians 5:10), the lord has ordered us to awake and say these things to you. Take care lest you be seduced and excluded from the kingdom." The Emperor Theodosius listened and glorified the lord who did not allow his people to perish. But the men again lay down and fell asleep ..Even today the men lie asleep in that spot, covered by cloaks made of silk or linen. The record of their suffering which with the assistance of a Syrian I translated into Latin gives a fuller account.
It is clear that Mohammad plagiarized The Companions of the cave from the earlier Christian tale, the 7 sleepers of Ephesus which is exactly the same but Mohammad changed it from being about Christians persecuted by the Romans for not following their gods to being about Muslims persecuted for not following pagan gods. From the Islamic perspective this tale makes no sense as the men came back to warn Theodosius II a Christian emperor of a heretical danger to Christianity which denied the day of resurrection but this is the very same religion that Mohammad would later denounce. So why Allah would want to protect it? this makes no sense so this is obviously why Mohammad removed it from its Christian context. The Incredibility of this tale is furthered by having the sleepers from the original tale quoting St Paul, who Muslims consider a false prophet. There is no way that the original tale fits with Islamic theology in any sense and as I have proven Mohammad twisted it to suit his own ends. But im sure muslims will say this version is corrupted and only the Koran has it right. If so bring some proof!
It is clear that Mohammad plagiarized many beliefs, teachings, doctrines and stories from Christianity. I have proven so conclusively and Muslims cant deny this irrefutable evidence. The Koran is not the word of any deity but of a 7th century Arabian plagiarist
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Wed Aug 26, 2009 4:00 pmsantiaguista: I believe that you cannot see the woods for the trees. Let me be the devil's advocate.
Muhammad was, by all descriptions "illiterate" so how could he read Hebrew Old Testament or the Bible? It wasn't even written in Arabic at that time. So if he could not read or write it how could he plagiarise?
So I suggest that you scrap your hypothesis and start afresh.
(1) Who actually wrote the Koran, or who authorised it to be written?
(2) Were all the manuscripts or tablets used when writing the Koran? What was destroyed? Why were they destroyed? Who ordered them destroyed? Was it for religious or political reasons that some parts of the original religious antiquities were destroyed? So did the plagiarism occur during the writing of the Koran? How long after the death of Muhammad did anyone start writing the Koran. How much of it was verbally transmitted? How much of this verbal transmission was corrupted by the time of the writing of the Koran? So a much deeper study is needed to research into the initial writing of the Koran and the Hadiths.
(3) I suggest that you are going about it with the cart before the horse. Sorry! sorry! sorry!
Muhammad was, by all descriptions "illiterate" so how could he read Hebrew Old Testament or the Bible? It wasn't even written in Arabic at that time. So if he could not read or write it how could he plagiarise?
So I suggest that you scrap your hypothesis and start afresh.
(1) Who actually wrote the Koran, or who authorised it to be written?
(2) Were all the manuscripts or tablets used when writing the Koran? What was destroyed? Why were they destroyed? Who ordered them destroyed? Was it for religious or political reasons that some parts of the original religious antiquities were destroyed? So did the plagiarism occur during the writing of the Koran? How long after the death of Muhammad did anyone start writing the Koran. How much of it was verbally transmitted? How much of this verbal transmission was corrupted by the time of the writing of the Koran? So a much deeper study is needed to research into the initial writing of the Koran and the Hadiths.
(3) I suggest that you are going about it with the cart before the horse. Sorry! sorry! sorry!
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Thu Aug 27, 2009 2:55 amelle wrote:santiaguista: I believe that you cannot see the woods for the trees. Let me be the devil's advocate.
Muhammad was, by all descriptions "illiterate" so how could he read Hebrew Old Testament or the Bible? It wasn't even written in Arabic at that time. So if he could not read or write it how could he plagiarise?
So I suggest that you scrap your hypothesis and start afresh.
(1) Who actually wrote the Koran, or who authorised it to be written?
(2) Were all the manuscripts or tablets used when writing the Koran? What was destroyed? Why were they destroyed? Who ordered them destroyed? Was it for religious or political reasons that some parts of the original religious antiquities were destroyed? So did the plagiarism occur during the writing of the Koran? How long after the death of Muhammad did anyone start writing the Koran. How much of it was verbally transmitted? How much of this verbal transmission was corrupted by the time of the writing of the Koran? So a much deeper study is needed to research into the initial writing of the Koran and the Hadiths.
(3) I suggest that you are going about it with the cart before the horse. Sorry! sorry! sorry!
fist off none of this has anything to do with the Bible but extracanonical texts. secondly he probably encountered these things orally due to Christian communities in Arabia. If not from them from his first wife's cousin Waraqah who was a Nestorian literate priest. Nestorianism was a Christian heresy which is probably how so many heretical writings made their way into the koran.
There is nothing wrong with my hypothesis as there is ample proof for it so why would I scrap it? just because he could not read doesn’t mean he could not plagiarize, as I said he probably encountered these things orally as in Arab culture storytellers and tales were very important back then. But anyway there is no proof that Mohammad actually was illiterate other than Muslim sources who may have just invented the whole thing much later in order to make his koran seem divine and not the product of his devious mind. We have no neutral sources confirming he was illiterate but even so there are even some ahadith which do indicate Mohammad could read. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yumJtRk ... annel_page
I already know that stuff, im not a moron. 20 years after Mohammad’s death caliph uthman ordered that one unified codex of the koran be produced in the qurashi dialect and burnt all the variant manuscripts. all of the koran was verbally transmitted in 7 different dialects. And as for corruption, if you have read about the sana manuscripts they indicate quite a bit of the Quran has been altered. This was not the subject of my post.
My point with this post was to expose the Koran’s spurious origins by showing how it blatantly plagiarizes many earlier Christian texts.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Sun Aug 30, 2009 3:40 pmThe fact that Jewish and Christian theology was borrowed by Muhammad or other Islamic scholars to compile the Koran, does not imply that Muhammad plagiarised the Bible. But Mohammadism was not born out of a void or from the instructions of the angel Gabriel, so many of the concepts will have come from Judaism and Christianity.
There were also several people responsible for the final writing of the Koran and any one of these patrons may have insisted on something deleted or added to the original writings to enhance its authority. Who had the Koran compiled? Some say Uthman, others say Abu Badr, and others say Caliph Ali. Wh had the biggest impact on the Koran, written years after the death of Muhammad and handed from mouth to mouth?
" The Quran Compiled by Imam Ali (AS)
There is no dispute among Muslim scholars, whether they are Sunni or Shia,
concerning the fact that the Commander of Believers, Ali (AS), possessed a
special transcript of the text of Quran which he had collected himself, and
he was THE FIRST who compiled Quran. There are a great number of traditions
from Sunni and Shia which states that after the death of the Holy Prophet
(PBUH&HF), Imam Ali sat down in his house and said that he had sworn an
oath that he would not put on his outdoor clothes or leave his house until
he collects together the Quran.
Sunni references:
- Fat'hul Bari fi Sharh Sahih al-Bukhari, by Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, v10,
p386
- al-fihrist, by (Ibn) an-Nadim, p30
- al-Itqan, by al-Suyuti, v1, p165
- al-Masahif, by Ibn Abi Dawud, p10
- Hilyatul awliya', by Abu Nu'aym, v1, p67
- al-Sahibi, by Ibn Faris, p79
- 'Umdatul Qari, by al-Ayni, v20, p16
- Kanzul Ummal, by al-Muttaqi al-Hindi, v15, pp 112-113
- al-Sawa'iq al-Muhriqah, by Ibn Hajar al-Haythami, Ch. 9, Section 4, p197
- Ma'rifat al-Qurra' al-kibar, by al-Dhahabi, v1, p31
There are also traditions from the Imams of Ahlul Bayt which tell us that
this was done by Imam Ali by order of the Holy Prophet (See al-Bihar, v92,
pp 40-41,48,51-52).
This transcript of Quran which compiled by Imam Ali (AS) had the following
unique specifications:
a) It was collected according to its revelation, i.e., in the order in
which it had been sent down. This is the reason that Muhammad Ibn Sireen
(33/653 - 110/729), the famous scholar and Tabi'i (disciples of the
companions of the Holy Prophet), regretted that this transcript had not
passed into the hands of the Muslims, and said: "If that transcript were in
our hands, we would found a great knowledge in it."
No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
There were also several people responsible for the final writing of the Koran and any one of these patrons may have insisted on something deleted or added to the original writings to enhance its authority. Who had the Koran compiled? Some say Uthman, others say Abu Badr, and others say Caliph Ali. Wh had the biggest impact on the Koran, written years after the death of Muhammad and handed from mouth to mouth?
" The Quran Compiled by Imam Ali (AS)
There is no dispute among Muslim scholars, whether they are Sunni or Shia,
concerning the fact that the Commander of Believers, Ali (AS), possessed a
special transcript of the text of Quran which he had collected himself, and
he was THE FIRST who compiled Quran. There are a great number of traditions
from Sunni and Shia which states that after the death of the Holy Prophet
(PBUH&HF), Imam Ali sat down in his house and said that he had sworn an
oath that he would not put on his outdoor clothes or leave his house until
he collects together the Quran.
Sunni references:
- Fat'hul Bari fi Sharh Sahih al-Bukhari, by Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, v10,
p386
- al-fihrist, by (Ibn) an-Nadim, p30
- al-Itqan, by al-Suyuti, v1, p165
- al-Masahif, by Ibn Abi Dawud, p10
- Hilyatul awliya', by Abu Nu'aym, v1, p67
- al-Sahibi, by Ibn Faris, p79
- 'Umdatul Qari, by al-Ayni, v20, p16
- Kanzul Ummal, by al-Muttaqi al-Hindi, v15, pp 112-113
- al-Sawa'iq al-Muhriqah, by Ibn Hajar al-Haythami, Ch. 9, Section 4, p197
- Ma'rifat al-Qurra' al-kibar, by al-Dhahabi, v1, p31
There are also traditions from the Imams of Ahlul Bayt which tell us that
this was done by Imam Ali by order of the Holy Prophet (See al-Bihar, v92,
pp 40-41,48,51-52).
This transcript of Quran which compiled by Imam Ali (AS) had the following
unique specifications:
a) It was collected according to its revelation, i.e., in the order in
which it had been sent down. This is the reason that Muhammad Ibn Sireen
(33/653 - 110/729), the famous scholar and Tabi'i (disciples of the
companions of the Holy Prophet), regretted that this transcript had not
passed into the hands of the Muslims, and said: "If that transcript were in
our hands, we would found a great knowledge in it."
No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Gabriel » Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:14 pmYou guys may be interested in some of Julian Charteris' posts which have just been imported from the old forum to WikiIslam:
Parallelism Between the Qur'an and Judeo-Christian Scriptures
Parallelism Between the Qur'an and Judeo-Christian Scriptures
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Sun Aug 30, 2009 4:50 pmGabriel, thank you for the links. I will read them as time permits. Most appreciated.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by SAM » Sun Aug 30, 2009 5:39 pmWho told you that?elle wrote:
This transcript of Quran which compiled by Imam Ali (AS) had the following
unique specifications:
a) It was collected according to its revelation, i.e., in the order in
which it had been sent down. This is the reason that Muhammad Ibn Sireen
(33/653 - 110/729), the famous scholar and Tabi'i (disciples of the
companions of the Holy Prophet), regretted that this transcript had not
passed into the hands of the Muslims, and said: "If that transcript were in
our hands, we would found a great knowledge in it."
No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
Deaf, dumb, and blind, they will not return (to the path).(al-Baqarah 2:18)
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Mon Aug 31, 2009 10:03 am- elle
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by SAM » Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:44 pmThanks for the link.elle wrote:http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/4.html
The Quran is the Word of God. The Prophet Muhammad spoke was Kalam-ullah, the Word of God. No doubt about its authenticity, genuineness, and that has not been fabricated.You said, No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
Only "Those who are Firmly Grounded in Knowledge" the Prophet and his Ahlul-Bayt (Family of the Prophet Muhammad) to prove the authenticity of the Quran.
Allah said in Quran: [3:7] He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book; in it are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the Book: others are not of well-established meaning. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the part thereof that is not of well-established meaning. Seeking discord, and searching for its hidden meanings, but no one knows its true meanings except Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord:" and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.
SAM....Servant of the knowledge of the Ahlul Bayt,
Deaf, dumb, and blind, they will not return (to the path).(al-Baqarah 2:18)
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:24 amI am not doubting what is in the Koran today or what it says.
What I am questioning is, "The Origins of the Koran." When was it first written? Who began it? Who re-wrote it? What were the sources of the originals? What is the proof of the authenticity of the originals? Were there any political motives with the patrons of the Koran? Why were some bits of the Koran destroyed? So if it was destroyed, what was being hidden. If Patrons or scribes can write the Koran years after the death of Muhammad, who did not have the chance to approve of the script, and the angel Gabriel or Allah did not tell the Patron or scribes what to write, how do you know what was written was authentic? Give me proof.
What I am questioning is, "The Origins of the Koran." When was it first written? Who began it? Who re-wrote it? What were the sources of the originals? What is the proof of the authenticity of the originals? Were there any political motives with the patrons of the Koran? Why were some bits of the Koran destroyed? So if it was destroyed, what was being hidden. If Patrons or scribes can write the Koran years after the death of Muhammad, who did not have the chance to approve of the script, and the angel Gabriel or Allah did not tell the Patron or scribes what to write, how do you know what was written was authentic? Give me proof.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:38 pmelle wrote:The fact that Jewish and Christian theology was borrowed by Muhammad or other Islamic scholars to compile the Koran, does not imply that Muhammad plagiarised the Bible. But Mohammadism was not born out of a void or from the instructions of the angel Gabriel, so many of the concepts will have come from Judaism and Christianity.
There were also several people responsible for the final writing of the Koran and any one of these patrons may have insisted on something deleted or added to the original writings to enhance its authority. Who had the Koran compiled? Some say Uthman, others say Abu Badr, and others say Caliph Ali. Wh had the biggest impact on the Koran, written years after the death of Muhammad and handed from mouth to mouth?
" The Quran Compiled by Imam Ali (AS)
There is no dispute among Muslim scholars, whether they are Sunni or Shia,
concerning the fact that the Commander of Believers, Ali (AS), possessed a
special transcript of the text of Quran which he had collected himself, and
he was THE FIRST who compiled Quran. There are a great number of traditions
from Sunni and Shia which states that after the death of the Holy Prophet
(PBUH&HF), Imam Ali sat down in his house and said that he had sworn an
oath that he would not put on his outdoor clothes or leave his house until
he collects together the Quran.
Sunni references:
- Fat'hul Bari fi Sharh Sahih al-Bukhari, by Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, v10,
p386
- al-fihrist, by (Ibn) an-Nadim, p30
- al-Itqan, by al-Suyuti, v1, p165
- al-Masahif, by Ibn Abi Dawud, p10
- Hilyatul awliya', by Abu Nu'aym, v1, p67
- al-Sahibi, by Ibn Faris, p79
- 'Umdatul Qari, by al-Ayni, v20, p16
- Kanzul Ummal, by al-Muttaqi al-Hindi, v15, pp 112-113
- al-Sawa'iq al-Muhriqah, by Ibn Hajar al-Haythami, Ch. 9, Section 4, p197
- Ma'rifat al-Qurra' al-kibar, by al-Dhahabi, v1, p31
There are also traditions from the Imams of Ahlul Bayt which tell us that
this was done by Imam Ali by order of the Holy Prophet (See al-Bihar, v92,
pp 40-41,48,51-52).
This transcript of Quran which compiled by Imam Ali (AS) had the following
unique specifications:
a) It was collected according to its revelation, i.e., in the order in
which it had been sent down. This is the reason that Muhammad Ibn Sireen
(33/653 - 110/729), the famous scholar and Tabi'i (disciples of the
companions of the Holy Prophet), regretted that this transcript had not
passed into the hands of the Muslims, and said: "If that transcript were in
our hands, we would found a great knowledge in it."
No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
I do think the Koran plagiarizes the bible whether done by Mohammad or his followers we do not know for sure. My personal opinion is that Mohammad incorporated biblical stories from the Jews and Christians he encountered into his religion. I don’t think he literally read the bible and decided which bits to throw out and which to keep. I see the Koran as a synthesis of various religions namely Christianity, Judaism, Arab paganism and Zoroastrianism. Most of the stories in the Koran about Jesus are oral
traditions which we rerecorded in the apocryphal gospels later. This seems to fit with Mohammad’s supposed illiteracy if we agree for the sake of argument he really was illiterate then its perfectly conceivable for Mohammad to have encountered these
oral traditions within his society, orally through people he encountered. He had 40 years before his alleged prophethood to encounter these stories in the Arabian peninsular and on his trade journeys to other lands. This seems far more likely than he getting it from Jibril.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:55 pmelle wrote:I am not doubting what is in the Koran today or what it says.
What I am questioning is, "The Origins of the Koran." When was it first written? Who began it? Who re-wrote it? What were the sources of the originals? What is the proof of the authenticity of the originals? Were there any political motives with the patrons of the Koran? Why were some bits of the Koran destroyed? So if it was destroyed, what was being hidden. If Patrons or scribes can write the Koran years after the death of Muhammad, who did not have the chance to approve of the script, and the angel Gabriel or Allah did not tell the Patron or scribes what to write, how do you know what was written was authentic? Give me proof.
None of this is the subject of this post my sole goal was to expose the origins of many tales in the Koran which predate Islam and come from a variety of Christian texts. This is what I was focusing on before you railroaded my post. Since the original
Pre-uthman manuscripts are lost much of this is supposition. We know that much of the Koran has been changed as the Sana manuscripts the earliest Koran in existence expose this but we have nothing before that so we don’t know how much they were3 changed. It was never my desire to enter into a debate on this topic but rather to paste my findings after studying the origins of many tales in the Koran for the good of people interested in the subject on FFI as this is the only place on the net which has contains a lot of this stuff and i felt people should know
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:58 pmSAM wrote:Thanks for the link.elle wrote:http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/4.htmlThe Quran is the Word of God. The Prophet Muhammad spoke was Kalam-ullah, the Word of God. No doubt about its authenticity, genuineness, and that has not been fabricated.You said, No one is even sure the true authenticity of the Koran.
Only "Those who are Firmly Grounded in Knowledge" the Prophet and his Ahlul-Bayt (Family of the Prophet Muhammad) to prove the authenticity of the Quran.
Allah said in Quran: [3:7] He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book; in it are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the Book: others are not of well-established meaning. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the part thereof that is not of well-established meaning. Seeking discord, and searching for its hidden meanings, but no one knows its true meanings except Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord:" and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.
SAM....Servant of the knowledge of the Ahlul Bayt,
The Koran is the word of no diety but a bunch of spurious Christian fairytales. If you think the Koran is the word of god then please try to refute this post with something other than claiming everything is a previous revelation
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Tue Sep 01, 2009 3:50 pmWho wrote the Koran? Do you even have an idea? I mean who supervised the scribing to the Koran? How many early version were there? How and Who rationalised these various versions? Don't tell me Allah wrote the Koran. 
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins(wrong statement)
by abdal » Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:04 amAs salaam alaikum to all brothers and sister and hello to non-believers.
i came accross this topic as the conversations was going between Elle,sam and Santiaguista about islam'e plagiarized chirstian origins and after reading i felt to leave my comments on this.
Brothers and sisters santaiguista and elle how long do we carry or stretch the same things again and again in a new form or in a new shape but the theme will be same. CHIRISTIANS THEMSELVES PROVED THAT BIBLE HAS 40 WRITTERS and if you still think that QURAN or MUHHAMMED COPIED IT From bible then as you all know he was an illetrate and if someone who says he was not illetrate then to both of you people who believe and who dont believe read carefully .
If people who says MUHHAMMED p b u h has copied the QURAN from any where please provide me a proof .
if people who says he could read and write then please i too love to see the proof and please santiaguista if QURAN copied the idea of bible then why QURAN has more knowledge about the universer and why bible dont have? if QURAN is been written by HUMAN or COPIED then why QURAN challenged to all non believers to write a same book, if not write a same paragraph, if not then write just a sentence. if a man written QURAN then how confident he is that he challenged the whole world atleast to write a sentence similar to QURAN. Dont you guys have brain or your brains have been dead?( i was impressed by elle's knowledge and the way she was explaininig thing but i dont know what happen with elle in this topic) ex: the guy who made titanic said even the god cannot drown it but you and the whole world knows the fact. similar way IF MUHHAMMED( p b u h) was not a messenger of God and he copied the idea of BIBLE then what was the GOD doing? when MUHHAMMED said in QURAN "WRITE ATLEAST A SENTENCE SIMILAR LIKE QURAN " do you think that god might have kept quite to this challenged if MUHHAMMED ( P b u h) was not his messenger and if ALLAH never wrote the QURAN,will GOD keep quite? when he cant bear just a simple statement of the owner of titanic then how did he bear this biggest challenged by MUHHAMMED? please my dear brothers and sisters think logically . And what was the CHRISTIANS DOING WHEN MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) WAS COPIYING THE IDEAS? WERE THEY SLEEPING? ALTEAST ONE ATLEASTTTTTTTTTTT ONE WOULD HAVE STAND AGAINST MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) same way as you have stood today.
Well after reading to your conversation i believed that you atleast agreed that there was a man Muhhammed (P B U H ) in 1400. now can i ask you how fast was the techonology at that time? was there any car which one can travel? was there any aeroplane? a rocket? a satelite? if no then HOW COME MUHHAMMED (p b u h ) SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE MOON AND THE SUN AND THE STARS and many more things? and HOW CAN THE MODERN SCIENTIST PROVED ALL OF HIS STATEMENT TRUE?
please my dear brothers and sisters just tell me what enimity you have against ISLAM? or you just cant accept the TRUTH?
i came accross this topic as the conversations was going between Elle,sam and Santiaguista about islam'e plagiarized chirstian origins and after reading i felt to leave my comments on this.
Brothers and sisters santaiguista and elle how long do we carry or stretch the same things again and again in a new form or in a new shape but the theme will be same. CHIRISTIANS THEMSELVES PROVED THAT BIBLE HAS 40 WRITTERS and if you still think that QURAN or MUHHAMMED COPIED IT From bible then as you all know he was an illetrate and if someone who says he was not illetrate then to both of you people who believe and who dont believe read carefully .
If people who says MUHHAMMED p b u h has copied the QURAN from any where please provide me a proof .
if people who says he could read and write then please i too love to see the proof and please santiaguista if QURAN copied the idea of bible then why QURAN has more knowledge about the universer and why bible dont have? if QURAN is been written by HUMAN or COPIED then why QURAN challenged to all non believers to write a same book, if not write a same paragraph, if not then write just a sentence. if a man written QURAN then how confident he is that he challenged the whole world atleast to write a sentence similar to QURAN. Dont you guys have brain or your brains have been dead?( i was impressed by elle's knowledge and the way she was explaininig thing but i dont know what happen with elle in this topic) ex: the guy who made titanic said even the god cannot drown it but you and the whole world knows the fact. similar way IF MUHHAMMED( p b u h) was not a messenger of God and he copied the idea of BIBLE then what was the GOD doing? when MUHHAMMED said in QURAN "WRITE ATLEAST A SENTENCE SIMILAR LIKE QURAN " do you think that god might have kept quite to this challenged if MUHHAMMED ( P b u h) was not his messenger and if ALLAH never wrote the QURAN,will GOD keep quite? when he cant bear just a simple statement of the owner of titanic then how did he bear this biggest challenged by MUHHAMMED? please my dear brothers and sisters think logically . And what was the CHRISTIANS DOING WHEN MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) WAS COPIYING THE IDEAS? WERE THEY SLEEPING? ALTEAST ONE ATLEASTTTTTTTTTTT ONE WOULD HAVE STAND AGAINST MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) same way as you have stood today.
Well after reading to your conversation i believed that you atleast agreed that there was a man Muhhammed (P B U H ) in 1400. now can i ask you how fast was the techonology at that time? was there any car which one can travel? was there any aeroplane? a rocket? a satelite? if no then HOW COME MUHHAMMED (p b u h ) SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE MOON AND THE SUN AND THE STARS and many more things? and HOW CAN THE MODERN SCIENTIST PROVED ALL OF HIS STATEMENT TRUE?
please my dear brothers and sisters just tell me what enimity you have against ISLAM? or you just cant accept the TRUTH?
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by elle » Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:07 amabdal, simple answer. Islam is determined to have a world caliphate. I wish to maintain my own independence in a FREE WORLD.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by abdal » Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:32 pmAs salaam alaikum brothers and sisters ,Hi to all non believers and sisters
Elle by no mean we muslims every tried to force people to change their religion but we just tried to passed the truth . my dear friend Elle,if one accepts ISLAM it doesnt mean he will not enjoy freedom as many or most of all have heard that ISLAM has curtain restrictions,yes but these are only for the benefit of human.
Still i respect your feelings and your view ,henceforth i was just trying to clear the doubts and to spread the truth and now its upto people who believed it or who dont want to believe it.
Elle by no mean we muslims every tried to force people to change their religion but we just tried to passed the truth . my dear friend Elle,if one accepts ISLAM it doesnt mean he will not enjoy freedom as many or most of all have heard that ISLAM has curtain restrictions,yes but these are only for the benefit of human.
Still i respect your feelings and your view ,henceforth i was just trying to clear the doubts and to spread the truth and now its upto people who believed it or who dont want to believe it.
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins(wrong statement)
by Santiaguista » Sat Sep 05, 2009 2:08 amabdal wrote:As salaam alaikum to all brothers and sister and hello to non-believers.
i came accross this topic as the conversations was going between Elle,sam and Santiaguista about islam'e plagiarized chirstian origins and after reading i felt to leave my comments on this.
Brothers and sisters santaiguista and elle how long do we carry or stretch the same things again and again in a new form or in a new shape but the theme will be same. CHIRISTIANS THEMSELVES PROVED THAT BIBLE HAS 40 WRITTERS and if you still think that QURAN or MUHHAMMED COPIED IT From bible then as you all know he was an illetrate and if someone who says he was not illetrate then to both of you people who believe and who dont believe read carefully .
If people who says MUHHAMMED p b u h has copied the QURAN from any where please provide me a proof .
if people who says he could read and write then please i too love to see the proof and please santiaguista if QURAN copied the idea of bible then why QURAN has more knowledge about the universer and why bible dont have? if QURAN is been written by HUMAN or COPIED then why QURAN challenged to all non believers to write a same book, if not write a same paragraph, if not then write just a sentence. if a man written QURAN then how confident he is that he challenged the whole world atleast to write a sentence similar to QURAN. Dont you guys have brain or your brains have been dead?( i was impressed by elle's knowledge and the way she was explaininig thing but i dont know what happen with elle in this topic) ex: the guy who made titanic said even the god cannot drown it but you and the whole world knows the fact. similar way IF MUHHAMMED( p b u h) was not a messenger of God and he copied the idea of BIBLE then what was the GOD doing? when MUHHAMMED said in QURAN "WRITE ATLEAST A SENTENCE SIMILAR LIKE QURAN " do you think that god might have kept quite to this challenged if MUHHAMMED ( P b u h) was not his messenger and if ALLAH never wrote the QURAN,will GOD keep quite? when he cant bear just a simple statement of the owner of titanic then how did he bear this biggest challenged by MUHHAMMED? please my dear brothers and sisters think logically . And what was the CHRISTIANS DOING WHEN MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) WAS COPIYING THE IDEAS? WERE THEY SLEEPING? ALTEAST ONE ATLEASTTTTTTTTTTT ONE WOULD HAVE STAND AGAINST MUHHAMMED ( p b u h) same way as you have stood today.
Well after reading to your conversation i believed that you atleast agreed that there was a man Muhhammed (P B U H ) in 1400. now can i ask you how fast was the techonology at that time? was there any car which one can travel? was there any aeroplane? a rocket? a satelite? if no then HOW COME MUHHAMMED (p b u h ) SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE MOON AND THE SUN AND THE STARS and many more things? and HOW CAN THE MODERN SCIENTIST PROVED ALL OF HIS STATEMENT TRUE?
please my dear brothers and sisters just tell me what enimity you have against ISLAM? or you just cant accept the TRUTH?
First off I wasn’t even talking about the bible these were extracanonical Christian texts not in the bible so please try to understand that. How many writers the bible had is irrelevant to this post as I never quoted from the bible once. Pelase learn the difference between the texts I was talking about and the Bible before commenting.I have proven conclusively that the Koran copied far earlier Christian hymns which is where the Islamic jannah comes from, it copied every story about Jesus’ nativity and early years from various apocryphal nativity gospels, it copied a common Christian
legend in surah Al-Kahf known as the 7 sleepers of Ephesus and the Koran’s very denial of the crucifixion is taken from Gnostic docetism. These stories all predate Islam and were very popular amongst eastern Christians both heretical and orthodox. If this isn’t plagiarism then please explain how all these tales made their way into the koran? please refute this post!
We have no proof Mohammad was illiterate other than Islamic sources who may have invented it just to make his Koran seem divine. Even so there are some ahadith which indicate Mohammad was not illiterate I posted al ink for them before. Even so I think Mohammad appropriated sot of these things not by reading but orally through his contact with Christians and through waraquah a Nestorian priest related to him through marriage who was literate.
There were surah’s like the Koran hundreds of years before Islam existed I have already proven that. All muslims can say when confronted with damning eviden e is produce a surah like it , islam is the fastest growing religion or youll see when you burn in hell... predictable
These seem to be a common muslim blanket defense which are really pathetic
You accuse me of not having a brain when you spout this drivel? The titanic ? oh my god your really grasping at straws now.
The Eastern Christians were off busy fighting a war against the Sassanaids whilst Mohammad was copying their ideas that is what they were doing. They had more important things to worry about that a self proclaimed prophet plagiarizing their ideas.
Mohammad knew nothing of science, that is absolute garbage. This forum is full of ex Muslims you really think there would be so many if the science of the Koran was in anyway convincing in regards to science? It is laughable. According to the Koran mountains prevent earthquakes, Allah holds up birds , the earth is spread out flat like a carpet, sperm comes from between your ribs and back bones. According to the ahadith Mohammad says that the seasons are caused by hellfire complaining, black cumin cures all diseases, 1 wing of a fly has poison the other the antidote, non Muslims have 7 intestines, a fever is caused by heat from hellfire, meat decays because of jews, adam was 90 feet tall
etc etc . so please don’t talk to me about Mohammad’s amazing scientific knowledge or the miracles of the Koran as its pure BS. Does any of this sound at all scientific to you?Islam is not the truth it’s the greatest falsehood ever, I have proven your Koran plagiarized far earlier texts. Please refute this post or stop wasting our time with such utter nonsense which proves nothing.
The Koran is not the word of any deity but a synthesis of many Christian, Jewish, Arab pagan, Hindu and Zoroastrian concepts, myths and oral traditions. I have proven that even your heaven the reason so many follow the Islamic faith so as to get into heaven even that is plagiarized from the writings of a 4th century Christian saint. Why should I believe in a god who has to plagiarize his heaven from some Christian hymns?
Please refute my post with evidence and not such nonsensical rubbish
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Re: Islam's Plagiarized Christian Origins
by Santiaguista » Sat Sep 05, 2009 2:18 amabdal wrote:As salaam alaikum brothers and sisters ,Hi to all non believers and sisters
Elle by no mean we muslims every tried to force people to change their religion but we just tried to passed the truth . my dear friend Elle,if one accepts ISLAM it doesnt mean he will not enjoy freedom as many or most of all have heard that ISLAM has curtain restrictions,yes but these are only for the benefit of human.
Still i respect your feelings and your view ,henceforth i was just trying to clear the doubts and to spread the truth and now its upto people who believed it or who dont want to believe it.
You must not know much about islamic history then as there have been many forced conversions in the history of your religion. But as islam has its own psuedo-histories it doesnt suprise me
You spread no truth just moronic garbage. you really expect such drivel which almost totally ignored anything to do with my original post really to disproves it? I don think so. you have disproved nothing just cited weak Islamic apologetics and the great lie about science in the Koran. You are deluded to the extreme. After having talked to you I just thank god I wasn’t born a Muslim as you have displayed the classic Muslim delusions by stating such lies, propaganda and misinformation which characterized many of the Muslims which I have encountered. If you can disprove that the Koran plagiarized all these texts (none of which are the bible) I will convert to Islam right now
